bostonbubble.com

[Boston ITer]

Hello everyone,

I know what I'm saying is controversial but let me start by saying this... the Boston area is highly depended upon people moving here, starting companies, and and least attempting to create the next DEC or Biogen.

The first step of this process is the exclusivity of schools like MIT and Harvard. The idea is the students, from around the world, move here to get the *next big thing* in technology from studying at or doing research at MIT.

Instead of acknowledging this fact, MIT instead went into this opencourseware idea, as if the coursework being done at MIT is unique and not reproducible. That's a critical mistake, here's why.

Private college education of America is simply too expensive. Right now, there are comparable engineering programs in the world with lower tuition, starting at the Univ of Illinois/UC and eventually, in other parts of the globe like the NU at Singapore, St Petersburg Polytechnic, the IITs in India, Imperial College London, etc . What MIT had, over them, was name recognition and a sense of secrecy in the work that was done over there. Now, it's obvious to anyone who downloads the notes that MIT is just that, an American institute with industry connections, not a place just for Einsteins and Teslas.

And that's the mistake. As R&D gets more and more offshored, these international locations will be the place where people will want to study science and engineering. Using MIT OCW notes, as a base template, the instructors from around the world can create comparable programs to the best American engineering programs and now, no one has to come to Boston for that MIT certificate.

[admin]

[Brian C]

[john p]

What I love about the technology schools is that it is like sports, it's about performance. You can't fake it. You don't become a lineman on the Patriots by who your father was, you either get knocked on your ass or you knock the other guy back period.

Getting into Harvard requires not only good performance, but a strong network. Lots of international students are chosen based on the potential impact their network can provide Harvard's network. For this reason, Harvard tends to get more wealthy and connected families which is part of the reason why their endowment is so large.

Harvard has to worry about maintaining quality. With graduates like George W. Bush and the long list of CEO's and principals at the failing banks it kind of puts a tarnish on their reputation. I mean when you get into the second or third generation of patronage things weaken. I mean look at how they just want to annoint Caroline Kennedy as Senator from New York because her father was JFK.

If you can lay the golden eggs and you're out in front, you really have nothing to worry about and if you can't maintain leadership so be it. I kind of think it is cool that MIT is confident enough to share and not try to hoarde the "Ground Breaking" position. It would be nice if one of the colleges you mentioned actually came up with something great that improved our quality of life over here. Don't you think it is time other nations took the lead in some things. I mean France was out in front in flight at one point, and Italy had some amazing inventors. Germany was amazing with technology. What was that movie when the general said "Shit, I'd piss on a spark plug if it did any good"? If someone could come up with a device that heated homes or powered cars and got us out of this oil mess, or cured Cancer, I don't care where they are from. If they clone Pam Anderson that's cool too.

[Boston ITer]

Folks, I'd heard all of those arguments for much of my life. Now... let me tell you why I think you're living in the past.

The MIT entrepreneurs, not just the bright ones (4.0/1600s) who'd turned down scholarships to Univ of Illinois/UC, Georgie Tech, or Carnegie-Mellon, were enamored with the Ken Olsen and the Bill Hewitt stories. Yes, this crowd is different from the NEU or WPI local crew who were mainly in search of co-ops than in start-ups. For years, this entrepreneurial culture was all over the Boston area with the epicenter at Kendall Sq. Realize, this is the dividing line which splits MIT off, from the CalTechs, Cooper Unions, and the Harvey Mudds; all the latter, full of smart kids, but little vision beyond that of publishing papers and getting straight A's. MIT had the blend of business visionaries and hard working, smart people.

Since the '01-'02 downturn, the money which has been flowing to Kendall was isolated into biotech a/o bioinformatics companies. Other MITers had a tough time getting financing and so many had joined their other classmates in trying to land quant jobs on Wall St. Now, where a lot of us Bostonians have our arrogance is that we falsely believe that everyone around the world has MIT-envy and wants to be in Boston. Well, relatively speaking, if a smart (and entreprenuerial) person in Tsinghua Univ in Beijing {the Caltech/MIT of China} can get access to the same start-up opportunities over there, since Kendall Sq is stagnant these days, then perhaps the whole Boston thing is overrated. Now, couple that with the whole OpenCourseware, it even creates less of an incentive to show up in Mass. Yes, as an outside observer, you may be less aware of it but as a worker in tech, when I see a slew of MITers dumping hi-tech for let's say, building an automated S&P futures "trading signals" system and then another few opting for law school, I find myself scratching my head... where did we go wrong?

[john p]

I know it's a stretch, but pretend I'm an idiot I see your positon as the difference between pure and applied knowledge. In order to put the knowledge to use you need an application and a big carrot is compensation.

The "What" they invent is what I'm interested in. What do you think the big mover is?

I always thought that with super computers we could simulate the behavior of natural laws virturally. Basically, we could create the effect of gravity and test how things like projectiles or flying machines could work, or create a chemical field with all the inputs of the periodic table and their atomic behavior and do biotech research.

[Boston ITer]

[Boston ITer]

[Guest]

Take a look at this, University of Chicago at Singapore, a little far from the Windy city. (http://www.chicagogsb.edu/visit/singapore/index.aspx)

In effect, our leading academic institutes aren't landlocked and can also be globalized, just like any corporation. When the time comes, MIT will move to China and perhaps, do joint MIT-Beijing University programs out there. A brand is a brand. The people, who I feel sorry for, are all the up and coming, bright teens who think that having a good education makes a difference in the world.

[JCK]

[barry]

do i think there is a threat for this today... not really.. most of the best and brightest get a lot more from the interactions and "network" than the cirriculum. I travel a lot on international business and the IIT and top chinese schools are more difficult to get into "by precentage of applicants accepted, than to mit... Perhaps in time the benefits of being at mit vs opencourseware may change but for now there is more value in the interactions.

That being said what is concerning is the paltry number of engineers that we produce every year... in the past we had a large influx of immigrants "primarily asian and eastern europeans" that came to the US for advanced degrees and saw the opportunities that were here. These opportunities were much greater than in there home country and some of the most compelling scientific advancments have come from these sources and created vast wealth and jobs in the US.... that is changing as we are no longer seen as the best place to make money as a young talent... more and more students are staying in there home countries to chase those dreams.

maybe open courseware will help engage those students in the concept of not only the US but of the success that has been acheived by MIT students and staff.... or perhaps it will just train them on the best way to duplicate those paterns and succeses in their own country to our long term detriment... who knows.

One thing is certain if we do not focus on "and government sponsored" R&D from a root basis ( the STEM initiative is just a start and something i am proud to be a part of) we will continue to see a massive redistributiion of wealth world wide.

I know some with disagree but the obama plan does not create the type of jobs that will long term provide financial stability to this country.. at best it is a band-aid. If similar dollars and efforts were focused on developing new technologies and (manufacturing, services, etc) we could once again have unlimited potential as a society. My fear is that today with our lack of innovation, doggy day cares and rampant consumerism of goods made in china we are going down a very slippery slope....

But then again lets bailout wallstreet so that their executives can get there bonuses (per goldman).. and besides a mechanism to get businesses financing.. financial services does not create

[Boston ITer]

Barry, let me tell you something. MIT/Stanford/Harvard, etc had represented American power to Asians and eastern Europeaners for decades.

Today, they see them as we (the ordinary worker bee) see bankers ala Hank Paulson's crew, Wall Street Fat Cats. You see, what the world is doing is slowly awakening to the idea that MIT isn't a place, circa Boston, but a concept... if we organize our brightest youths and academicians, that we can overachieve and invent new industries. And these new industries don't have to be in the 128/495 beltway. I only wish that the average reader of this thread would drop the whole "4.0/1600/Westinghouse award" awe and see that the world doesn't want to patronize the Boston area, so that their youths can learn something about advanced technologies.

What the OpenCourseware does is inadvertently tell the world, "Here, we're smart, just look at our curricula". Sorry, but that's not a correct message because all it does is tell everyone to stay home and make their own country, another superpower like America. All and all, the truth of the matter is that the US is in its decline and MIT isn't helping by putting our only name brand on the internet for the world to copy.

[admin]

[Boston ITer]

[Boston ITer]